See the new MOB patch
(reproduction of the original circa 1971)
soon to be available to interested Mobility Operations Veterans
(& their friends and family).


Tan Son Nhut
                            Association Logo
Tan Son Nhut Association
Reunion 2009

October 15 -18, 2009
Pigeon Forge,
Tenessee


F4 Crew Chief Receives Purple Heart 39 years after being wounded at TSN during Tet mortar attacks.

8th Aerialport Airman receives Purple Heart for wounds at Bu Dop nearly 40 years ago.



Aerial Port Mobility Teams Reunion 2013
October 8-11, 2013 - Branson, Missouri
Initial Proposal

FINAL PLANS



Aerial Port Mobility Teams Reunion 2012
Wright-Pat AFB



Aerial Port Mobility Teams Reunion 2007
WEEKEND OF AUG. 25
Chardon, Ohio

A small, informal get-together of the 68-70 MOB teams (others welcome) has been planned for the weekend of August 25, 2007 at Neil Brown's place in Chardon, Ohio.
Nothing fancy, just a few old 8th MOB veterans getting together a Neil's house to hang out for a day or two, catch up on the past (almost 40) years and have a few beers.
see the  8th MOB Forum. for details.

Photos from the gathering in Chardon,Ohio




Aerial Port Mobility Operations Reunion 2006
WEEKEND OF SEPT. 29 & 30 and OCT 1st.
Rising Sun, Indiana (near Cincinatti, Ohio)
see photos & story

The 8th MOB's second 'official' reunion was a resounding success. We spent a great weekend together at Cary Louderback's place in Indiana and had a chance to see each other, share photos and stories, correcting inconsistencies and errors in this current narrative, discuss suggestions for improving the web site and put together more of the history of this unique little unit.

Thanks to Cary for his warm hospitality, and for making this event possible.
Watch here for a photo essay to be published shortly.

We also have begun plans for another get together for next year and will be contacting everyone directly via email this time. Rather than simply rely on Forum messages, we will be reaching out to you. Please be sure to leave your current email address with us on the 8th MOB Forum.



8th APS MOB Veterans First Reunion - 2005
We got together again...
Washington, DC - September 24, 2005 - at The Wall

Rubbing from the
                                                Wall - our teammate,
                                                Ssgt Web Layton, KIA
                                                Budop, 1969
Panel of Ssgt Webb Layton
KIA Bu Dop, Vietnam, December, 1969

We met at 12:00 noon. And it was a very special meeting....

Last spring, long-lost MOB Team member Jim Wade tracked us down via this website. (The last time I had seen Jim was in 1970 when we was very, very short and we were defusing left-behind frag grenades at Duc Phong.)

In April, my wife and I met up with Jim and his wife at a coffee shop in the Shenandoah Valley. It was great to see Jim - after more than 30 years - and many miles, pounds and gray hairs. But, I recognized Jim immediately by his confident swaggering walk - and his bright, somewhat devilish smile. After a hour's animated conversation, it appeared that he really hadn't changed a bit!

He suggested at that time he, Sgt. Neil Brown and myself
(the only three MOB Team members we were in direct contact with at the time) should meet for an informal reunion at Web Layton's panel on the wall. Ssgt. Web Layton was a Mob Team member KIA during an attack at Bu Dop in December, 1969.

As it turned out, we were joined by Steve Carlson, who had been at one of our Dets as well as our Captain "Raging Ray" Rubel, now a "Retired Air Force" officer, who we remembered well from his youth as the dashing, gun-toting OIC of the 8th APS MOB...  photos to follow...

Since then, through the diligent efforts of retired MSgt Jim Wade, we have turned up more of the team. So. Plans are under way for a next reunion. Very informal, just a group of (now old) Mob Team Vets getting together to prove to ourselves that we really did survive... and continue to.

Thanks to all who joined us.
Watch here for future plans.

View the guestbook.

Watch here for info on getting an 8th MOB hat.



New Photos October, 2006

Photo of Sgt Neil Brown's Crispy Forklift at Budop

Not only did we collect about 50 new photos from the guys at the 2006 reunion, but Connie Lisec sent us a large batch of photos collected by her late husband, Colonel Victor Lisec, Squadron Commander of 8th APS in 1969 & 1970, and major supporter of the 8th APS MOB teams. It will take some work to get these all scanned and built into pages, but the work on that has begun.

New photos to be posted have been supplied by Ray Rubel - Capt, OIC of MOB, 1969 & 70, Don Horton, CCT, 1972, Allen Glenn, '70-72, "Big Willie" 71-72, Jim Wade, 1967-70, Neil Brown, 1967-70.
There are many, and it will take some time, so please bear with me and don't hesitate to remind me if you don't see your photos on line. - Alan




New June 1, 2006
Photos and Docs supplied by Allen Glenn, 71-72
(scanned as Adobe Acrobat .pdf files)
Vietnam Airlifter, April 1971 - Khe Sanh
Airman Commedation Medal Orders - April, 71
photos:
Photos of Tan Son Nhut



New April 1, 2006:
Photos from Quan Loi
1969 & 2001
 
submitted by Dave King.



Website updates: 10/05/2006: (post-reunion)

Connie Lisec, the widow Colonel Victor Lisec - our Squadron Commander from 1969-1970, has graciously agreed to share the Colonel's photo collection with us. The first package arrived today and includes the famous, long sought after photo of Sgt. Neil Brown with his forklift at Budop - the one which was burnt up in November, 1969. This photo along with many others supplied by Mrs. Lisec will be added to our story just as quickly as I can get them posted on pages.

We also have approximately 50 more new photos collected from the members who attended our reunion in Indiana this past weekend. These are also 'in the works' as new pages. Links to these photos and pages will be added here just as soon as they are on the web site.

We are also making plans to create a "what ever happened to....." section, where we can more easily search for our buddies and find out what happened to them since our time together in Vietnam. Forum hackers continue to be a problem, and although we are able to identify and remove unwanted posts rapidly, some do get through now and then. The new forum system will hopefully eliminate the hackers as well as resolve some other problems reported by members.

- webmaster


THE PHOTO WE'VE BEEN SEEKING FOR ALMOST TWENTY YEARS
Sgt. Neil Brown and his 10k AT - Budop,
                        1969

Sgt Neil Brown and his 10kAT at Budop, November, 1969.

Sgt Brown had been seperating Fuel Bladders and Pallets of Live Ammo during a mortar attack when an incoming mortar round ignited a fuel bladder right behind him. He could not move forward; he could not back up. He was trapped in the blaze and had to abandon his forklift and escape on foot. The ensuing fire and explosions continued for hours, effectively destroying the entire supply of both fuel and ammunition - from small arms to howitzer shells, as can be seen in the foreground.
After the fire was over and explosions had died down, this was what was left of the 10 K Adverse Terrain forklift.
This is the photo we have been trying to track down for many years.
A framed copy of this photo was on the wall outside of 8th APS Squadron Commander Col. Lisec's office at TSN and was the first photo many of us saw of the MOB teams at work in Vietnam when we arrived there in January of 1970.
photo courtesy of Connie Lisec from the collection of Colonel Victor Lisec.

See another photo of this AT as it was burning.



That was then, and this is now... more history 1954-2008

The players and unit and organization names may have changed, but the mission's just the same.
Then it was 10K AT's and C-130's... and now it's 60k loaders and C-17's
  • A LETTER from active duty airlifter MSgt Chris Swinson, who "followed where you (we) paved the way".
    "I learned an oral history of the MOB units in Viet Nam through half-remembered tales from older aerial porters...
    ...Many of us used to sit around and speculate on what it must have been like, but the stories and
    the pictures on your page bring it home.Thank you!
    "
  • MobilityOperations in Southwest Asia, 2008
  • webmaster replies: MSgt Swinson, thank *you* for recognizing us for who we were and for what we did.

Note our new domain name: Now this site can be reached at http://8thMob.org



Our Unit; Our History in Vietnam
Vietnam Service Medal

The 8th Aerial Port Squadron, was a squadron of the 834th Air Division, USAF, with headquarters at
377th Combat Support Group's Tan Son Nhut Airbase*. 8th APS was responsible for tactical airlift aerialport support throughout southern South Vietnam. 8th APS supplied the teams that loaded and unloaded the planes that carried personnel and cargo into, out of and throughout the countryside of the southern areas of Vietnam. It's headquarters was at the Tan Son Nhut airfield in Saigon, former capital of South Vietnam. Although now officially known as "Ho Chi Minh City", it is - and will likely be forever - recognized as "Saigon".

*(Note from our Guestbook - ref Sam McGowan 8th Aerial Port wasn't always under the 377th Combat Support Group. Originally, it was organized under the 315th Air Division and the Second ADVON. When 834th Air Division activated under Seventh Air Force in August 1966, 8th Aerial Port fell under it, along with the 315th Air Commando Group.
Ref: Captain (retired LC) Ray Rubel, our OIC in 1970, the 8th APS came under operational control of the 834th Air Division, but was a *tenant* of the 377th CSG at TSN.

*Webmaster note: When this site began, I'd been pretty much out of touch with other MOB team members for about thirty years, so it was based mostly upon my own recollections of 1970. As the site has grown, it's collected comments, information, photos and stories from MOB members, as well as the loadmasters, pilots, Special Forces and US Army members we worked with . This is not "my" website, it's "our" website and grows in meaning and value because of the contributions of all readers and friends.


Although the 8th Aerial Port handled all cargo and passenger traffic at "the world's busiest airport" (Tan Son Nhut Airbase in Saigon), it also included a lesser known special organization known as "Dets & OL's" - Detachments and Operating Locations - which included 8th APS' Mobility Operations, which we simply called "The MOB teams". 

Detachments ("Dets")  typically included 6-10 men stationed at larger US Army base camps with runways, running water and sufficient need to justify a full-time USAF presence to handle passenger and cargo traffic at more or less permanent bases. 8th APS had permanent detachments at Bien Hoa, Cu Chi, Tay Ninh, Song Be, Quan Loi, Phuc Vinh and other bases to the north of Saigon as well as Can Tho, Binh Thuy and other bases deeper in the delta. 

8th Aerial Port hootch at Tay Nihn, Vietnam,
                    circa 1969These detachments (such as TayNinh's, photo from Ssgt Jim Lavender) typically included relatively permanent buildings, communications facilities, US Army defenses and hot meals... ... and frequent attacks by the Viet Cong, and in some cases even the troops of the North Vietnamese regular army.
 

Djamap photo by
                      KenFillmoreOperating Locations ("OLs") were spread all over the countryside and were manned as needed by 7-man "Mob" teams of the Mobility Operations Branch, a part of Dets & OLs. On these missions, the mixed teams of Loadmasters and Air Freight specialists lived on the largess of their hosts or subsisted on C-rations and slept in very crude bunkers, muddy holes in the ground or directly under the stars - often outside of the SF defensive perimeter. Communication was supplied by 2-man Air Force "Blue Beret" Combat Control Teams (CCT) or the infamous antiquated, unreliable and very heavy PRC-25 'radio' which almost never seemed to work as expected...

Caribou Pilot Ken Fillmore's Photo of the Djamap Airstrip, along the Cambodian border in 1970
Djamap, aka "FSB Snuffy" to the Army, was a frequent operating location for 8th MOB teams.
(from the C7Caribou Association website).




This site is dedicated to those airmen who participated in


Aerial Port Mobility Operations

throughout Vietnam, during time of conflict,
and salutes those who carry on the tradition of the original 8th Aerialport MOB in the Mobility Airlift Command units of today's Air Force.

There is no doubt about it. Since our mission included tactical airlift support in areas which could not be easily - or safely - reached by road, since many of our missions were classified as "Combat Emergency" and each takeoff and landing was counted as a "Combat Assault", and since many of our men were wounded - and some died - by enemy fire, and we were often targeted specifically as we worked our aircraft...
And since we were armed and equipped and actively contributed to camp defense where ever we were and since we often spent days and nights - and sometimes weeks - with the Army in their little jungle firebases and with The Special Forces in their jungle camps, Mobility Operations was quite often close to or involved in direct combat, and was by no means the typical 'safe' rear-echelon sort of Air Force assignment some might otherwise assume.
A1C
                          Runfeldt, Ssgt Shinley at DjaMap

8th APS MOB TEAM AT WORK

8th MOB team member A1C Runfeldt carrying M-102 (105mm) howitzer on one of our famous USAF 10K Adverse Terrain "Flying" Forklifts.

Ssgt Roy Shinley approaching C-123 about to be loaded. Location: Djamap (aka FSB Snuffy/Bu Gia Map) spring or summer, 1970.
See Caribou pilot Ken Fillmore's aerial photo of this airstrip. This scene took place in the bottom right corner of Ken's photo.
Click on image above to see original full scene. By the way.. who snapped this photo?

For that matter, many of the Detachments experienced just as many attacks as we did in the field.

That's why they call this "Combat Airlift".

And we were all volunteers, proud to be part of - and accepted by - our Mob Teams.

According to documents published by Maxwell AFB, official doctrine was as defined below:


"Air transport in major warfare should be used when practical for the supply of combat units, for evacuation, and for emergency troop movements...

That's what we did.





Our equipment included just about everything required to create an 'instant cargo center' in the jungle - 10-thousand-pound-capacity Adverse Terrain Forklifts - the famous "10k AT", designed specifically for missions such as ours, the smaller "6k RT" Rough Terrain forklift, the PRC-25 "portable" radios and our personal gear - M16's for the team members, plus revolvers for the team chiefs, as well as other weapons collected in our travels... and, of course, the ubiquitous military clip board - although maintaining paper records was always a challenge under our working conditions... 

In both cases, the planes handled by these 8th APS teams typically included C-7 Caribous of the USAF, US Army Special Forces, and the Australian AAF, USAF C-123s based within Vietnam and many C-130's manned by crews based outside of Vietnam, but on 30-day rotating tours "in country". We also occasionally handled - and traveled in - Chinook CH-47 Cargo helicopters of the US Army. Sometimes, our teams had to be transported - or evacuated - by UH-1b "Huey" choppers as well.

These locations were typically at remote Special Forces camps or 1st Cav artillery bases, although the 8th Mob also supported the Vietnamese & U.S. Marine Corps at times, and some Mob team members received commendations from the U.S. and Vietnamese Marine Corps.

The Special Forces camps at Bu Dop, Tonle Cham, Katum, Rang Rang and others along the Cambodian border were frequently visited by the MOB teams for 1-3 day stays. U.S. Army Fire Support Bases such as Bu Gia Map (FSB Snuffy, aka Djampa on Air Force maps) and others were also familar to these traveling freight handlers.

While much of the time, things were quiet and the only dangers were accidents, sunburn, heat exhaustion, homesickness and malaria, there were also many times when the Viet Cong added to the danger and attacked these teams at work. 

  • Khe Sanh -
    During the siege of Khe Sanh in 1968, volunteers from the 8th APS were sent TDY to augment 15th APS' airlift support of Khe Sanh. At least one of these 8th Aerialporters wound up at Khe Sanh with the 15th APS mobility team and lived with the US Marines in the trenches and bunkers of the besieged camp. Their purpose was to load and unload the C-7's, C-123's & C-130's that made it through the NVA fire to land at what was quite likely the most dangerous airfield in the world at that time. Not all of the planes that took off from or tried to land at Khe Sanh made it. (We are currently getting information about their time at Khe Sanh from 8th APS' Neil "Brownie" Brown, 15th APS' Ted Winkelman & Bob Byers and LT.Col (army) Ron Parsons, all of whom were there during the seige.

    In June of 1970, 8th APS Mobility and Combat Control teams assisted the US and Vietnamese Marines in their efforts at Kham Duc, a Special Forces camp near Khe Sanh. CCT Sgt Dave Gfeller was wounded during that mission.

    In 1972, a large 8th APS MOB team supported Lam Son 719 from Khe Sanh dur
    ing the last major offensive of the war - the drive into Laos. Their story and photos will be added to this site in the future. For now, we have the Vietnam Airlifter report as an Adobe Acrobat .pdf file. Vietnam Airlifter


"Mortar Magnet" - Khe Sanh, 1968

Incoming rounds slammed into the runway and apparently struck the C-130's left main landing gear, causing the aircraft to swerve and smash into a forklift.


from Bruce Geiger's account of his time at Khe Sanh

Also: See Sam McGowen's account of Tactical Ailift at Khe Sanh

Video of Khe Sanh revisted three years later
C-130 hit
                        upon landing - ran into our forklift


  • Bu Dop - Special Forces Camp A341
    Correction: Through the fog of long-past memories (and, since I was not there myself), three "incidents at Bu Dop" (circa Nov-Dec, 1969) had been erroneously merged into one. There were many bad times at Budop, both before and after Nov-Dec 69. But few match these two particular incidents, which have been clarified through the help of former Mob Team members Sgts Neil Brown, Lou Cox & Paul Appel, the SF Medic who treated our wounded - four who were there and Sgt Jim Wade who was at HQ that day.

    Here's the update as we have reconstructed events as of 2006.0208, with further updates after the reunion 2006.0929:

  • November, 1969 - Special Forces Camp A341 Bu Dop. Sgt Neil Brown, operator of the 10K Adverse Terrain Forklift designed specifically to be used in such environments, became trapped between exploding munitions and burning fuel as he was trying to separate them during a rocket attack. Sgt Brown was forced to abandon his rig, which was burned to a crisp. A dramatic photo of this incident (which many of us may have already seen hanging on the wall outside the Squadron Commander's office at 8th APS HQ in Saigon over thirty years ago),  is now in our posession and will be posted on this site in the future.

  • December 1969 - Bu Dop. (updated 10/06)  In two seperate incidents, an entire MOB team was effectively disabled, with 5-6 WIA during during one of the increasingly frequent rocket attacks directed at the dirt airstrip near the SF camp at Budop.

  • According to recently-re-connected Team Members Paul Appel, & Lou Cox (and soon to be corraborated by Ssgt Jim Greene who were all among the WIA list of that morning), the team was leaving BuDop Special Forces compund on their AT Forklift when a round landed in front of them.

    The blast sprayed the forklift and all mounted members with shrapnel, wounding Paul Appel, Doug Cave, Scott McCoy, Jim Greene & Lou Cox. A Vietnamese Irregular soldier who was with them apparently bore even more of the blast, since, according one of the survivors, "he simply disappeared".

  • On a seperate mission on December 7. 1969, Ssgt Webb Layton was killed by a single mortar round. Jim Wade recalls returning to the MOB HQ that afternoon and being told by TSgt. Allen that we'd "lost a team member"...

  • At Tonle Cham in May, a 5th SF C-7 Caribou came under motar attack during offload, and in their haste to escape, dropped their cargo load on the ground as they taxied away and took off "like a bat out of hell." At this time, the Tonle Cham camp already had a few planes laying in wreckage on the side of the runway. Their quick takeoff kept this crew alive and their plane intact and flying.. but it did cost us the fresh fruit and vegetables A1C Runfeldt was trying to offload when the plane moved out of reach of our AT...
  •   

     
  • In the spring of 1970, an 8th APS team member at Song Be jumped into a foxhole during a particularly devasting VC attack and manned an M-60 machine gun for hours, warping the barrel by the heat of continued long bursts at the attacking VC. Not at all a typical Air Force experience... and one not easily forgotten.

  •  
  • During a May, 1970 communications mission at the infamous northern base at Kham Duc (see http://members.aol.com/BlndBat/khamduc.html (search on "Kham Duc" at Google for more), CCT Ssgt Dave Gfeller was wounded by shrapnel from a VC RPG rocket. Although wounded and medevaced to an Army hospital, Dave made it back to Saigon - on his own - by late that evening and was warmly welcomed by his friends who had simply heard a radio transmission earlier that day requesting "We need a replacement controller at Kham Duc". Since the transmission was by SSgt Charlie Brown, we all knew it had been his regular teammate, Dave Gfeller who had been wounded. We were all happy and relieved to see him in bloodied hospital garb, but alive and home with his teammates. A photo of Charlie making this radio transmission is in the official USAF history of tactical airlift in Vietnam...

  •  
  • During the 12 months beginning in the summer of 1969, we lost one man KIA, with 14 Purple Heart medals and at least a half-dozen Bronze Stars awarded to the 21 members of the 8th APS Mob and dozen or so Combat Control team members who worked with us - for their wounds and brave action under the combat conditions of the 8th APS MOB missions. This was not a typical "safe job" for USAF personnel...

  • The above commentary chronicles only those events during this webmaster's tour (and shortly before I arrived). But now, with the input of MOB team members who served after 1970, the story is being expanded. Prior to 1969, the MOB unit was more loosely organized and after 1970, as the US Army stood down and left Vietnam, combat support at remote airstrips dwindled, leaving MOB teams quite literally alone on the air strips where they worked. As the war wound down, many detachments were closed and became operating locations with no permanent staff. See Cary Louderback's letter.

  • During Operation Lam Son 719 in 1972, the MOB team went back to Khe Sanh - oddly enough, where the MOB team story began in 1968 with a "TDY" to Danang which sent 8th APS mobility volunteers into hell for the three month Seige of Khe Sanh.

    In 1972, a formally organized and well-trained and well-equipped Mobility Operation served at the same location in support of the US and Vietnamese forces which attempted to stop the NVA. See the Adobe Acrobat .pdf file copy of the Vietnam Airlifter with their complete story of the 8th MOB at Khe Sanh in 1972.

  • Kontum
    In 1971, there were plenty of missions to Kontum - with some hairy stories to go with them. Some of this story is recounted on Cary Louderback's page


There were many other incidents such as described above. The hope of this site's webmaster is to provide a chronicle of the history and personal stories of these men and the others who, although enlisted in the USAF, lived and worked with the US Army & US Army Special Forces organizations thoughout some of the most dangerous territory in the war zone.

- Alan Runfeldt, USAF 1968-72, Vietnam 1970, Thailand, 1971.

Note: The above accounts are personal recollections (after 30 years) of one Mob Team member. We welcome your comments, additions and corrections.

See our "Personal Pages" links below for member's own stories.

Photos - we need photos - of any of the places mentioned within these pages. Photos of the places we worked at provide a verifiable link between our often-fogged memories and the reality of our lives 30 years ago. Thank you for any photos you can provide us with.

We'll be installing an automated image upload system to make the job go faster - and automate this process so that it gets done quickly.

 Please contact the webmaster via the guestbook or by using this secure message form.


 


Links to other sites which may be of interest to 8thAPS veterans:

Personal Pages
Visit the New - Member Photos directory
Visit the New - Member Pages - Our Stories of Vietnam


Dean Edwards' (many) Photos of Bien Hoa in '67-68 - an excellent record of his time at Bien Hoa - good photos with explanatory comments Dean Edwards' photos and pages convey the essence of one Airman's time in Vietnam, but represents memories all of us are likely to relate to. Thanks, Dean for putting together this excellent story.

New Detachments Page (coming)
New Mobility Locations Page (coming)

Where we worked:

MAPS:

PHOTOS: (thanks for a great number of these photos go to the Caribou Pilots who took them and Peter Bird's efforts to get them online)

8th Aerial Port (III & IV Corps, Tan Son Nhut):

Most of our missions were to small dirt strips adjacent to Special Forces Camps. Most - if not all - of the places mentioned below are documented on the Special Forces web site at http://www.thespecialforce.com/Camps/camps.htm
8th Aerial Port Detachments
14th Aerial Port (II Corps, Cam Ranh Bay):
15th Aerial Port (I Corps, Danang):
  • Mike Buck's photos of Danang
  • Tien Phouc (Tien Phuc) Special Forces Camp
  • - Mike Warren managed a 15th APS Det at Tien Phuc in 1970, Tom Finkler worked with C-7s' during the same time.

8th APS OLs - places we passed through on the way to work:
  • Song Be - Bob Payne's photo of Song Be Ramp
    (This photo was probably about 1968 - they were still using yellow Hyster forklifts. Note the beginning of the 8th APS HQ at Song Be - that little bunker beneath the tip of the wing of the C-130)
  • Tay Ninh
  • Bien Hoa


Who we worked with

Other links of interest: / USAF Air Mobility - Then and Now

VIDEO OF OPS AT CAN THO

Air Commando Video of C123 Operations at Can  Tho




Jack Shafer died 4/5/2004. Here's an mp3 of his poem about Vietnam, Vietnam Vets and The Wall.

SPECIAL ESSAY REGARDING THE WAR IN IRAQ - BUT UNIVERSALLY APPLICABLE ANYTIME SOLDIERS GO INTO BATTLE.
Col. TIM COLLIN's SPEECH TO HIS MEN
by Lt. Col. Tim Collins, commander of the 1st Battalion of the Royal Irish, as he and his men were about to leave Kuwait and head north into Iraq.

HERE'S SOMETHING NEW. SOMETHING WHICH I THINK WE WILL ALL FIND INTERESTING - AND IMPORTANT

"I have an agenda, and my agenda is this: I want my fellow soldiers to come home safely, and I want a better future for the people of Iraq. I also want people to know the truth." - Lt. Paul Rieckhoff - website
You GOTTA visit this website. See what it's like for the guys these days..
(and it's not Jane Fonda funny stuff in Iraq. These are soldiers reporting their experiences.)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



a Thanksgiving Day Song of the 60's...
for those of you who remember a song from long ago....
a special song...

Arlo Guthrie's
Alices Restaurant
(30 years later)
(mpg file)
listen and enjoy, compliments of The 8th MOB Teams



Check our ASK3 survey results - 8thmob.org ~ NoDeadlines.com/vietnam
Please contact the webmaster via the guestbook or by using this secure message form.


Something all Vets - and all Americans - Should Know:

excerpted from:

VIETNAM'S LAWRENCE OF ARABIA
or
(COUNTERINSURGENCY: The John Paul Vann Model)

By Rich Webster

Few know that the Viet Cong lost the war, and that they were no longer a viable force after 1968. The Viet Cong could not have won the war and bested the South Vietnamese Army in battle. The advisory effort in Vietnam wasn't perfect, but the South Vietnamese forces held their own in the 1972 Easter Offensive by the North.

The South Vietnamese Army (ARVN) was finally defeated in 1975 when they were invaded by the fifth largest army in the world. They were invaded by 17 divisions of the North Vietnamese Army to include over 700 tanks that steamrolled everyone in front of them.

The North Vietnamese were still being supplied with war materiel by their allies, the Soviets and Chinese, while the allies of the South Vietnamese, the United States, abandoned them in their hour of need.


No. We didn't "lose this one." We won the war we fought. Politics lost the war that replaced it...




last updated
July 8, 2008 ~ July, 2010 ~
Feb, 2011 ~ Sept, 2011 ~ June, 2012 Oct, 2012
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Feb, 2013 ~
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